Author Topic: What to do about unmaintained caches...  (Read 2180 times)

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rob-bleich

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What to do about unmaintained caches...
« on: February 08, 2016, 21:48:22 »
I live on the Quebec side of Canada's capital region and sometimes have noticed certain caches are never found because they are obviously not there (easy difficulty and many very experienced cachers not able to find them).  For whatever reason (often the owner has stopped caching), the cache owner doesn't perform maintenance yet the cache does not get disabled.  Sometimes, I have seen people just place a new container at GZ, say they have found it and that a container has been placed.

Is this appropriate behaviour? or not?

BlackRose67

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Re: What to do about unmaintained caches...
« Reply #1 on: February 09, 2016, 15:30:35 »
Log a Needs Maintenance on it.

If it's been a long standing issue, log a Needs Archived to bring it to the reviewers attention.

bluelamb03

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Re: What to do about unmaintained caches...
« Reply #2 on: February 10, 2016, 12:15:52 »
If you discover a cache that has been abandoned, perhaps it's missing,  in poor condition or is an obvious "throw down" and the cacheowner hasn't logged in for over a year (visible on their profile page) then log a "Needs Archive". This brings it to the reviewer's attention and starts the process of deleting the geo-trash from the listings.

Too many irresponsible cachers place hides all over the place and then walk away leaving the cache slowly decaying out there.....

Do us all a favour and help in getting rid of the trash.

Blue -
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Lone R

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Re: What to do about unmaintained caches...
« Reply #3 on: May 01, 2016, 13:30:33 »
If you discover a cache that has been abandoned, perhaps it's missing,  in poor condition or is an obvious "throw down" and the cacheowner hasn't logged in for over a year (visible on their profile page) then log a "Needs Archive". This brings it to the reviewer's attention and starts the process of deleting the geo-trash from the listings.

Too many irresponsible cachers place hides all over the place and then walk away leaving the cache slowly decaying out there.....

Do us all a favour and help in getting rid of the trash.

Blue -

Thumbs up. I especially agree with "Do us all a favour and help in getting rid of the trash."

Do it for those of us who visit the area and spend precious time and money on what we hope will be a pleasant adventure.

Last month I spent 3 days in the Kingston/Belleville/Madoc area and had a frustrating time. I posted a lot of DNFs, NMs and NAs.

It seemed like most hiders carry a sackful of pill bottles, aspirin jars, film canisters, throw-away food containers, and drop them everywhere (this is true all over Ontario unfortunately). They never intend to come back for a maintenance visit. 

Many caches were missing for months. Most had no NMs. Some had many NMs but no NAs.  The caches that were there were in rough condition. Wet or soaked, moldy, tattered logs. Broken caches that had been that way for months. No response from owners to repeated posts mentioning the cache was missing or in terrible shape.

I was actually glad that most of the caches that were in terrible shape,  were now missing. It gave me the opportunity to start the archival procedure by posting NMs and NAs. At least I could save someone else a frustrating, wasted trip.

I was elated when I found an authentic Lock & Lock (Lock & Lock embossed seal on the container), in great shape inside and out, with a dry clean logbook inside. That one got a favourite point.

My goal was to spend 5 days in the area and make my way to the Nepean area. But after 3 days of vacation caching, I didn't feel it was worth the extra hotel and gas money. I packed up and went home.


geobob7

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Re: What to do about unmaintained caches...
« Reply #4 on: May 05, 2016, 10:59:17 »
The original post was asking about missing containers, and in the specific situation mentioned (easy rating, experienced cachers can't find) I think it is appropriate for someone to conclude that the cache is indeed missing and leave a replacement container. It is in that case performing maintenance, just like putting in a new log if the existing one is full or not usable, or replacing the container itself if it is damaged. This action fixes the problem immediately and may save other cachers from having a wasted journey.

bluelamb03

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Re: What to do about unmaintained caches...
« Reply #5 on: June 05, 2016, 10:12:50 »
The original post was asking about missing containers, and in the specific situation mentioned (easy rating, experienced cachers can't find) I think it is appropriate for someone to conclude that the cache is indeed missing and leave a replacement container.

It's always nice when someone gives you a hand and does some cache maintenance for you when you're having trouble keeping up with things, but offering to replace a possibly missing container for a cacheowner, and putting out a new container for an MIA cacheowner who has abandoned the cache are two different things. I've found many caches where there are two containers at the GZ, the original cache and the new throw down placed by the lazy cacher who figures he's looked long enough, it must be missing.

And now that you've replaced the cache are you going to maintain this cache in perpetuity?

I don't think you're doing anyone any favours when you 'help' out, it solves the immediate issue but perpetuates the real problem here, the MIA cacheowner who abandons their geo-trash and the finders who don't use "needs maintenance" and "needs archive" logs properly to clean up the trash.

Blue -
« Last Edit: June 07, 2016, 09:19:35 by kirok »
Without shared stories we are strangers.
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lostinthegarden

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Re: What to do about unmaintained caches...
« Reply #6 on: June 05, 2016, 16:43:37 »
It's not necessarily a black and white situation.  It's true that the majority of abandoned caches that are missing or in poor shape should be considered to be geo-trash.  They should be archived and the remains, if any, removed by a volunteer.  But there are exceptions - caches that one could say have "heritage value".  A cache in this category typically was placed quite a few years ago (at least six or seven, and perhaps many more), and was a good weatherproof container in a nice spot (e.g., a great destination for a hike).  Though the owner is no longer caching, for whatever reason, he/she made a significant contribution to the game when active.  In a case like this, it's a reasonable proposition for the community at large to unofficially adopt and maintain it.

Here's the acid test: if there were a mechanism available for someone to adopt a cache from an owner who is inactive (in Groundspeak's eyes), would there be no shortage of people lining up to adopt it?  If so, a good case can be made that the community should keep it going rather than declaring it to be trash.

We have a soft spot for those oldies, and have helped to keep a few them in action.

bluelamb03

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Re: What to do about unmaintained caches...
« Reply #7 on: June 08, 2016, 20:52:45 »
Well I can't deny LitG's point, we unofficially maintained the binthair caches for years!

If you think it's an important cache then do your duty as you see it, but please remember that not all caches are created equal....

Blue -
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- Sheila Mendonça


Lone R

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Re: What to do about unmaintained caches...
« Reply #8 on: June 20, 2016, 10:55:20 »
The original post was asking about missing containers, and in the specific situation mentioned (easy rating, experienced cachers can't find) I think it is appropriate for someone to conclude that the cache is indeed missing and leave a replacement container.

It's always nice when someone gives you a hand and does some cache maintenance for you when you're having trouble keeping up with things, but offering to replace a possibly missing container for a cacheowner, and putting out a new container for an MIA cacheowner who has abandoned the cache are two different things. I've found many caches where there are two containers at the GZ, the original cache and the new throw down placed by the lazy cacher who figures he's looked long enough, it must be missing.

And now that you've replaced the cache are you going to maintain this cache in perpetuity?

I don't think you're doing anyone any favours when you 'help' out, it solves the immediate issue but perpetuates the real problem here, the MIA cacheowner who abandons their geo-trash and the finders who don't use "needs maintenance" and "needs archive" logs properly to clean up the trash.

Blue -


I'm noticing an exponential rise in throwdowns.

I'd believe it's about giving back to the community if those that throwdown didn't count their container as a find, if they left a quality container that cost a few bucks (real Lock&Lock(tm), Pelican(tm), Plano(tm) or ammo can, preform, Coghlans(tm) match container), and they maintained the container they threw down.



Lone R

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Re: What to do about unmaintained caches...
« Reply #9 on: June 20, 2016, 11:20:02 »
It's not necessarily a black and white situation.  It's true that the majority of abandoned caches that are missing or in poor shape should be considered to be geo-trash.  They should be archived and the remains, if any, removed by a volunteer.  But there are exceptions - caches that one could say have "heritage value".  A cache in this category typically was placed quite a few years ago (at least six or seven, and perhaps many more), and was a good weatherproof container in a nice spot (e.g., a great destination for a hike). 

Sounds like a cache that wouldn't need any maintenance.

Though the owner is no longer caching, for whatever reason, he/she made a significant contribution to the game when active.  In a case like this, it's a reasonable proposition for the community at large to unofficially adopt and maintain it.

To a point. A suspect you mean cache owners who have died. I can only think of one in my area that fits that description. His caches were adopted by his family, they continue to maintain them. 98% of abandoned caches are simply abandoned by an owner that is still alive. If a cache owner has died and hasn't bequeathed his/her caches, how do you know they would have wanted those caches propped up? I don't. My cache hides (husband/wife team) should be archived upon our death because we take great pride in our cache hides and the maintenance of them. I doubt anyone else would take as good care and I'd hate for them to become abandoned junk (as some adopted caches become). [Editted to add]: And we take great pride in putting out quality swag size containers, which almost certainly would become throwdown leaky micro containers if maintained by the community. And we would hate to have them coveted for their real value, the GCcode.

Anyway, the owner of the cache is not removed from the site. His/her caches are still there. As a CO I would prefer that someone placed a memorial cache and link to our profile page showing all of our old cache hides. Maybe say why they think we should be remembered for the caches we contributed to the game.




« Last Edit: June 20, 2016, 14:09:01 by Lone R »